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Thread: The COVID-19 Discussion Thread (OTB)

  1. #1201
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    The upcoming SuperBowl will be the first in which one of the teams will be playing on its home field, and the fans can't attend. Coincidence? Or are the gods of sports and diseases ganging up on us?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    The upcoming SuperBowl will be the first in which one of the teams will be playing on its home field, and the fans can't attend. Coincidence? Or are the gods of sports and diseases ganging up on us?
    If the numbers the evening news quoted are correct, they will allow enough fans in for 1/3 the capacity of the stadium. That seems a bit crowded for my taste.
    I may have many faults, but being wrong ain't one of them. - Jimmy Hoffa

  3. #1203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    The upcoming SuperBowl will be the first in which one of the teams will be playing on its home field, and the fans can't attend. Coincidence? Or are the gods of sports and diseases ganging up on us?
    In previous Super Bowls the NFL allotted each contending team with only 8,800 tickets to be made available for purchase by their season-ticket holders. And that's true this year as well. So while being local might yield some uptick in local fans, it usually wasn't enough to matter because the great majority of Super Bowl attendees are from out of town and not necessarily from one of the participating cities (or states).

    But that's in previous years; this year is a whole 'nother kettle of fish. There is the potential that 17,600 attendees - out of only 20,000 -will be season ticket holders for Tampa and Kansas City. Could be a fun!

    ETA: And a potential SuperBowlSpreader event!

  4. #1204
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    There is still the advantage of being "at home," even if the stadium isn't filled with fans. It's their own locker room, their own turf, and - for most players, anyway - their own homes rather than a hotel room. That can make a difference.

    Although my understanding is that the Chiefs are going to keep their practice remote and fly to Tampa Bay the day before the game, rather than the usual spending several days there.
    Sometimes you win, sometimes you learn

  5. #1205
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    I had forgotten about season ticket holders. If they're all going to stadium there might be fewer season ticket holders next season.

  6. #1206
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    I called yesterday to schedule Irene's well-child visit. Her doctor's office has updated their precautions, no doubt because of the weather--when Simon had his over the summer, you called in from the parking lot, and the nurse came out to you. Now, you call in from the parking lot, and the nurse calls back to tell you to come in when the waiting room is empty.
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  7. #1207
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    My wife and I have a primary doctor in the Houston Methodist system. Most of our specialists are in the same system. We received a notice that if we had seen any physician in their system within the last two years we would be notified when it was our turn to receive the vaccine. Yesterday I got a text informing me that I could schedule my appointment. So I did.

    Less than an hour after that I got a text from UT Physicians saying I could schedule an appointment with them. I forgot that I saw one of their specialists during the summer and apparently that put me in their system, too.
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  8. #1208
    A wealthy fairly young couple from Vancouver took a private plane to the Yukon and posed as hotel employees to get the vaccine ahead of time. They got fined over a thousand dollars a piece for the stunt.
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  9. #1209
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    I'm hoping that, with a third vaccine nearing approval, that sort of thing will be less necessary; I'm fearing that, with new variants mutating, we'll have another problem.
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  10. #1210
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Backroad Astronomer View Post
    A wealthy fairly young couple from Vancouver took a private plane to the Yukon and posed as hotel employees to get the vaccine ahead of time. They got fined over a thousand dollars a piece for the stunt.
    I live 20 minutes from the Canada-US border. I've never troubled myself to figure exactly how much screwing around in another country can be done. It just sounds like a bad plan.
    Solfe

  11. #1211
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Backroad Astronomer View Post
    A wealthy fairly young couple from Vancouver took a private plane to the Yukon and posed as hotel employees to get the vaccine ahead of time. They got fined over a thousand dollars a piece for the stunt.
    Kinda dumb, weren't they? The vaccine requires two doses, so they'd have to pull the same stunt 3-4 weeks later to get the second shot for the vaccine to work.
    Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
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    You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. They don’t alter their views to fit the facts. They alter the facts to fit their views.
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  12. #1212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Kinda dumb, weren't they? The vaccine requires two doses, so they'd have to pull the same stunt 3-4 weeks later to get the second shot for the vaccine to work.
    I'd guess that was the plan, being millionaires and all. But pretending to be employed at the local hotel in a town of only 100 inhabitants was not the brightest move, for sure. It's like an episode of Schitt's Creek that has fallen into our world from a morally reversed universe.
    But it would now appear they're going to have to wait until the summer for their second dose, when the vaccine priority list eventually works through to them.

    Grant Hutchison

  13. #1213
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Backroad Astronomer View Post
    A wealthy fairly young couple from Vancouver took a private plane to the Yukon and posed as hotel employees to get the vaccine ahead of time. They got fined over a thousand dollars a piece for the stunt.
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    I'd guess that was the plan, being millionaires and all. But pretending to be employed at the local hotel in a town of only 100 inhabitants was not the brightest move, for sure. It's like an episode of Schitt's Creek that has fallen into our world from a morally reversed universe.
    But it would now appear they're going to have to wait until the summer for their second dose, when the vaccine priority list eventually works through to them.

    Grant Hutchison
    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian Press
    ... those tickets have been stayed and the same charges are being served upon the couple on a longer-form information, with a notice to appear in court in Whitehorse.

    The distinction means that if they are convicted, they could also serve up to six months in jail.
    Hmm, the immunization plan for inmates may move them up the queue for their second dose, depending on conviction / sentencing.

  14. #1214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noclevername View Post
    As with any Conspiracy Theory, there's plenty of rationalization and cognitive dissonance to account for any inconvenient facts. In this case, the most popular excuse making the rounds is that the official reports "manipulate the numbers" by painting many independent illnesses and deaths as Covid-related.
    Well, this is partly true. There are a lot of deaths from strokes, heart attacks and heart attacks. But if you think so, a very large number of these cases are caused by a nervous strain, which arose just in the wake of the spread of COVID-19. And COVID is not a fiction or a horror story, it is a real virus that is really dangerous for certain categories of the population. And even for young and healthy people too, because they, too, often suffer from a severe disease. And all these restrictions (forced and reasonable) also add tension, increase the level of stress. And chain reactions occur in the body, which result in heart disease and neurological disorders.

  15. #1215
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    But those aren't independent, are they?
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    "Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

    "You can't erase icing."

    "I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

  16. #1216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kay Burton View Post
    Well, this is partly true. There are a lot of deaths from strokes, heart attacks and heart attacks. But if you think so, a very large number of these cases are caused by a nervous strain, which arose just in the wake of the spread of COVID-19. And COVID is not a fiction or a horror story, it is a real virus that is really dangerous for certain categories of the population. And even for young and healthy people too, because they, too, often suffer from a severe disease. And all these restrictions (forced and reasonable) also add tension, increase the level of stress. And chain reactions occur in the body, which result in heart disease and neurological disorders.
    Then the people who died, would not have died without Covid-19. So it's cause and effect.
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

  17. #1217
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    The relevant statistic here is "excess mortality", which is a good search term. We compare mortality during the pandemic to the average mortality for the same dates in the previous five years. We generally find it tracks the number of deaths certified as being caused by Covid, but is distinctly higher--that gives an estimate of the additional deaths that are associated with Covid-related psychological stress, economic hardship, healthcare avoidance, domestic violence, and so on.

    Grant Hutchison

  18. #1218
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    Why did they have to find this in South Carolina? I live in South Carolina!

    Virus variant from South Africa detected in US for 1st time.
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  19. #1219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger E. Moore View Post
    Why did they have to find this in South Carolina? I live in South Carolina!

    Virus variant from South Africa detected in US for 1st time.
    https://apnews.com/article/coronavir...16ddd6edbaf870
    Particularly unsettling is that neither patient traveled recently. That implies community spread.
    I may have many faults, but being wrong ain't one of them. - Jimmy Hoffa

  20. #1220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Extravoice View Post
    Particularly unsettling is that neither patient traveled recently. That implies community spread.
    Yeah, that was going through my head, too. Those two patients were on the Atlantic coast, and I'm in the foothills of the Appalachians, but that means nothing in a little state like SC.
    Do good work. —Virgil Ivan "Gus" Grissom

  21. #1221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger E. Moore View Post
    Yeah, that was going through my head, too. Those two patients were on the Atlantic coast, and I'm in the foothills of the Appalachians, but that means nothing in a little state like SC.
    The new variants don't kick down people's doors. Same rules apply: people, space, time, place.

    Grant Hutchison

  22. #1222
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    We have just had an emergency Press Conference given by the State Premier to announce that we have had our first Covid-19 case in this state in nearly 10 months. It seems that the infected person contracted it while working as a security guard at a quarantine hotel. The suspicion is that it is the 'UK Variant' but genomic testing is still under way. The South-West corner of the state, which contains about 80% of the state population, is going into a 5 day lockdown. All schools, hotels, bars, restaurants, hairdressers etc will be closed. Masks will now be compulsory outside the home and we will only be allowed to leave the house for medical, food shopping or local exercise for 1 hour - so the sort of thing familiar to many of you.

    Vaccination is hoped to be started in Australia in mid/late February - depending on the new export controls on the Pfizer vaccine in Europe. We are locally manufacturing the 'Oxford' vaccine but it will take a while to build up sufficient stock levels.

  23. #1223
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    The J & J vaccine looks good. Bill Maher had a couple of guest on Real Time talking about it. Now there are jokes about the.. ah..,other types of swabbing.

  24. #1224
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    The J & J vaccine doesn't look good to me. Better than no vaccine but far less effective than the Moderna, Pfizer and other vaccines

    I haven't read discussion anywhere on this so I'll ask here: given the potential for enormous difficulties posed by variants of CV-19, would it not make sense for all vaccine manufacturing capability across the world to be put to use producing whichever vaccine experts say is the best? In other words, J & J (and others) might be better serving society by producing the Moderna vaccine, if that is deemed the best one. Each pharmaceutical company would still continue research and each manufacturer would be paid for their efforts but the world would be supplied with more of the best product.

    We seem to be entering into a more dire situation with the emergence of variants, some of which may not be stopped by existing vaccines. The US has laws in place to compel manufacturers to make products in emergency situations. Sort of like how General Motors and Ford made armaments in WWII. I imagine other countries have similar laws. Hopefully, our leaders are having this conversation already.

  25. #1225
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    The COVID-19 Discussion Thread (OTB)

    Apparently, the J&J vaccine, while not preventing infection as well as the other vaccines in trials, reduced deaths to zero , and hospitalizations greatly. Also, ultra cold storage is not needed, nor a second dose.

    I suspect that choosing which is “better” has multiple facets, depending on the target population.

    As for manufacturing, I am not knowledgeable enough to comment if facilities for production of a vaccine like J&J’s (adenovirus) is suitable for mRNA manufacture.
    I may have many faults, but being wrong ain't one of them. - Jimmy Hoffa

  26. #1226
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    J&J looks like an excellent addition to the armamentarium, to me. Single dose, easy storage, demonstrated effectiveness against a new variant, and eventual complete protection against Covid-19 hospitalization and death with effectiveness ramping up over time. This is the sort of thing that's going to get a lot of countries out of the hole.
    And I think, especially given the continuing emergence of variants (none of which so far seem likely to have complete vaccine escape), we need to think of this very much as an armamentarium--vaccines that work in different ways, targeting different proteins, are very much what we need to have around right now. Now is not the time to choose a basket for all the eggs.

    Grant Hutchison

  27. #1227
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    I'm curious - is it normal for there to be more than one type of vaccine for a particular disease? How many polio vaccines are there, for example?

  28. #1228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Extravoice View Post
    As for manufacturing, I am not knowledgeable enough to comment if facilities for production of a vaccine like J&J’s (adenovirus) is suitable for mRNA manufacture.
    Companies can switch the genetic sequence of their mRNA fairly readily (weeks to months) but there can then be problems with tuning the bioreactor to produce the maximum number of doses--as we're seeing with AstraZeneca and the current stooshie in the EU at present. So forcing a company to change their particular mRNA is likely to introduce delays. And individual companies are already monitoring for necessary changes to their mRNA as new variants arise, and already have agreements with regulatory authorities to make such switches can occur rapidly if necessary.
    But many vaccines are not mRNA vaccines, so you can't switch a non-mRNA vaccine manufacturer to produce mRNA, or vice versa, or switch between different kinds of non-mRNA vaccine. And each mRNA vaccine manufacturer has its own method of delivering the mRNA. So you couldn't switch J&J from their own adenovirus vector (for which they have an established and tested production process) to AstraZeneca's lipid nanoparticles, for instance.

    Grant Hutchison

  29. #1229
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    My sister and her hubby got their first shot yesterday (both in their 80's). We and they used the local health dept sign up form on the web so we're hoping to get our upcoming shot notice soon, maybe? It's still slow going here but the 65+ group will hopefully be completed by the end of Feb (my guess).

  30. #1230
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    Quote Originally Posted by geonuc View Post
    I'm curious - is it normal for there to be more than one type of vaccine for a particular disease? How many polio vaccines are there, for example?
    Worldwide, certainly into double figures. The vaccine you get in the USA is usually not the same you get in the EU, which is not the same you get in Japan.
    As is usual with Covid-19, something that's been pretty routine in the background (in this case, lots of vaccine manufacturers producing different formulations) is being brought urgently to the attention of people who up to now have had no reason to think about the topic.

    Grant Hutchison

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