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Thread: The Covenant (from Halo) vs The Empire (From Star Wars)

  1. #31
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    Human Synth Droids (such as Guri) are illegal in the Republic/Empire. This is due to previous attempts to assasinate people and replace them with Synth-Droids. They do still exist, but are relatively rare. I can think of just a few examples off hand, but can't recall the names except for Guri (Shadows of the Empire.)

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhantomWolf
    Human Synth Droids (such as Guri) are illegal in the Republic/Empire. This is due to previous attempts to assasinate people and replace them with Synth-Droids. They do still exist, but are relatively rare. I can think of just a few examples off hand, but can't recall the names except for Guri (Shadows of the Empire.)
    I am pretty sure Lando's assistant in the floating city (they guy with the metal thing around his head) is another example.

  3. #33
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    I am pretty sure Lando's assistant in the floating city (they guy with the metal thing around his head) is another example.

    No, Lobot is a Cyborg.

  4. #34
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    Sorry, my mistake.

  5. #35
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    You know, I've occasionally said that this pair of lines was a good example of exactly how sarcastic Obi-Wan could be:

    Luke: Sand people. Look: bantha tracks, gaffi sticks. But I've never heard of them hitting anything this big.

    Ben: No. The tracks are two by two. Sand people always go single file to disguise their numbers. Look at the blast patterns. Only imperial stormtroopers are this [snicker] precise.
    Sand people shoot hand-maintained sniper rifles, and have to be crack shots. Doubly-so in a desert wasteland. "Shoot what little prey shows up or starve." And sand people look reasonably well fed, if little else.

    Then again, the Empire's doctrine at the time was "bigger, cheaper, faster". Stormtrooper gear was definitely of the "cheaper, faster" variety. And every piece of Imperial hardware at the time that tried for all three had a massive, exploitable flaw.

    Stormtrooper armor that restricts vision and mobility, but offers little-to-no effective protection from either blaster fire or blunt force (Ewoks). Plus, hand weapons that appear to have less accuracy than early smooth-bore muskets.

    The Death Stars with accessible reactors and open-to-space heating ducts rather than active coolant-exchange and surface radiators, which any PC hardware enthusiast will tell you is no more vulnerable to proton torpedo attacks from snub fighters than the rest of the case, no matter how big or small.)

    The Star Destroyers (Victory, Imperial and Super classes) with their bridge shield emitters underneath the communication towers. Destroy one, you compromise the other, rendering the ships immediately vulnerable to "decapitation". Plus, the apparent lack of a secondary control site and emergency chain of command in case the bridge facilities suffer a massive enough casulty, is quite the oversight.

    Lack of shields on imperial fighter craft considered "disposable" means for a highly Darwinian training regimen (and considerable turnaround) among pilots in the imperial navy, and the corresponding morale problems.

    AT-AT transports and AT-ST scouts that are vulnerable to catastrophic tripping... etc.
    "Words that make questions may not be questions at all."
    - Neil deGrasse Tyson, answering loaded question in ten words or less
    at a 2010 talk MCed by Stephen Colbert.

  6. #36
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    One thing to remember is that the Imperal Stormtroopers are all preconditioned from birth to be loyal to the Empire. I think other Imperial subjects can become officers (such as Han Solo). As such, I don't think the Stormtroopers suffer morale failures. That, and they are all clones. In the Star Wars Weapons & Tech book I had a few years ago, it discussed the Stormtrooper armor. It's supposed to be highly resistant to kinetic energy from projectile weapons, such as a modern gun. So once the that type of armor came out, propellant-based projectile weapons became useless. Blasters, though, can still punch through it like a hot knife through butter. The Star Wars blasters are more lethal than the Covenant plasma weapons (from what I've seen) since one blaster shot can kill an armored trooper, whereas a relatively unarmored human can withstand several shots from a Covenant plasma rifle.

  7. #37
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    Also the Storm Trooper armor seems to house and NBC protection system that lets them operate in hostile environments, while the Covenant soldiers don't have any such protections. A good nerve-gassing could end any ground battle really quickly, killing all the Covenant but leaving the Storm Troopers completely unaffected. Also, if the Storm Trooper armor is sealed well enough it might also be able to keep out the flood, at least for a while. Note that the flood couldn't directly infect Master Chief, it had to do damage to his armor first.

  8. #38
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    That's a good point. I was really surprised at the inclusion of the Flood. It seems that a really advanced civ couldn't just wipe it out and not have to wipe the galaxy out of inhabitants. But I guess that's why it was a plot force, and not just a little tidbit. Engineering a virus that would only affect Flood-contaminated organisms should be a trifle to those who constructed Halo in the first place...

  9. #39
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    Don't confuse precision and accuracy. I'm not sure exactly what Obi-wan meant when he said "precise" but saying that sand people are crack shots implies "accuracy".
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  10. #40
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    I think that it would be a close fight, but the covenant would eventually win. Assuming that other factions wouldnít join the fight.

    Iím currently running a Starwars RPG game in which, you guessed it, the Covenant attack. I had to modify the Covenant to the D20 system, and I wanted them to be as true to the games and books as I could get.

    So first things first, Covenant troops.
    If youíve read the books, during the early days of the conflict between the UNSC and the Covenant, the Covenant rarely fielded elites and hunters. My evidence is that in the first book, during the events leading up to the first game, hunters were just introduced (at the cost of a Spartanís arm) and Elites were only speculated to be field commanders. This is why the Covenant lost ground engagements with the UNSC. (Grunts and jackles are no match for a Spartan).

    In ground engagements with the Empire (post halo games) the Covenant would win, because an Elite with cover could pop out, take a Storm trooper down with plasma then pop back, let shields re-charge, repeat. As for weapons, granted a Stormtroopers blaster rifle is powerful, it would take to much time to put an Elites shields down. As for the plasma weapons, theyíre a little more devastating than what we see in the game. After all they do shoot a ball of superheated gas roughly 6000 degrees Celsius. I think that would leave a good sized scorch mark on the back plate of a stormtroopers armor... from the front...

    Now for Ship to Ship actions.
    The Covenant would win unless out numbered or out maneuvered. This is because Covenant shields are designed against energy weapons, and energy weapons are a BIG part of any starwars fleet. Also an average Covenant fleet usually operates with about 500 ships, that would be too much for any Imperial fleet to handle. Also Plasma torpedoes are extremely violent and devastating weapons, three shots could put a Stardestroyers shields down and another two would gut it. Now Iím not saying that the Empire doesnít stand a chance, they just have to pick there battles and hope that they donít run out of planets...

    A note on fighters.
    Iím quite certain that just one Seriph fighter is more than a match for a few Tieís.

  11. #41
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    The thing is that in the game you see the normal human troops get nailed by the blaster rifle and still live. Albeit they get scorched pretty well, but they can still fight.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kahardrin
    I think that it would be a close fight, but the covenant would eventually win. Assuming that other factions wouldnít join the fight.

    Iím currently running a Starwars RPG game in which, you guessed it, the Covenant attack. I had to modify the Covenant to the D20 system, and I wanted them to be as true to the games and books as I could get.

    So first things first, Covenant troops.
    If youíve read the books, during the early days of the conflict between the UNSC and the Covenant, the Covenant rarely fielded elites and hunters. My evidence is that in the first book, during the events leading up to the first game, hunters were just introduced (at the cost of a Spartanís arm) and Elites were only speculated to be field commanders. This is why the Covenant lost ground engagements with the UNSC. (Grunts and jackles are no match for a Spartan).

    In ground engagements with the Empire (post halo games) the Covenant would win, because an Elite with cover could pop out, take a Storm trooper down with plasma then pop back, let shields re-charge, repeat. As for weapons, granted a Stormtroopers blaster rifle is powerful, it would take to much time to put an Elites shields down. As for the plasma weapons, theyíre a little more devastating than what we see in the game. After all they do shoot a ball of superheated gas roughly 6000 degrees Celsius. I think that would leave a good sized scorch mark on the back plate of a stormtroopers armor... from the front...

    Now for Ship to Ship actions.
    The Covenant would win unless out numbered or out maneuvered. This is because Covenant shields are designed against energy weapons, and energy weapons are a BIG part of any starwars fleet. Also an average Covenant fleet usually operates with about 500 ships, that would be too much for any Imperial fleet to handle. Also Plasma torpedoes are extremely violent and devastating weapons, three shots could put a Stardestroyers shields down and another two would gut it. Now Iím not saying that the Empire doesnít stand a chance, they just have to pick there battles and hope that they donít run out of planets...

    A note on fighters.
    Iím quite certain that just one Seriph fighter is more than a match for a few Tieís.
    The question here is how to quantify their ability to defend against attacks. Star Destroyers demonstrate firepower greater than Earth's nuclear arsenal with it's point defense weapons (Source: Empire Strikes Back, Star Destroyers knocking out asteroids with it's turbo lasers).

    Just saying that they have designed defenses against a weapon system does not make them immune to it. We develop armor today and now to protect against projectile weapons, but those weapons are still a threat. Imperial ships are likewise defended against all manner of attacks, but are still vulnerable to them.

    Still, I don't know enough about Halo to predict an outcome. Played the first one through once, and that was about my exposure to it.

  13. #43
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    First of all, I would like to say that I've read all the books and comics, and I've played the games from both sides (so don't go thinking I don't know what I am talking about). If it was the Star Wars galaxy vs. the Milky Way (halo), Star Wars would win. If anybody would like to challenge me just say so, but right now I'm going to clear a few things up.

    In response to comment #2, Stormtrooper armor is vacuum sealed. The flood would not be able to penetrate the armor; because, the armor is made of an alloy the blocks projectiles, and it would also block the flood [the armor I'm referring to is Mark III (see Star Wars: Tales from the Empire)].

    In response to comment #3, It is not entirely true that the Empire relied on masses. Although some (like Tarkin...) did, others (like Grand Admiral Thrawn, Roan Fel, Lt. Sunber...) didn't. You'll have to explain how they "wipe out the population and just move on"; because, it isn't entirely right. There are a few elements a lightsaber can't penetrate. So in a plasma sword vs. a lightsaber, the lightsaber would win. The Death Star isn't lame. It's just the people commanding it in Episode IV weren't in their right minds (obsessed with destroying rebels) so they didn't activate certain shields (because they thought the Death Star was invincible, and they didn't realize X-wings could blow it up!). You said, "does the Covenant have access to the Halo network?", yes they do. If they activate it in time and get to Onyx, but they would only destroy themselves (the Empire would just jump into hyperspace).

    In response to comment #4, You are right "their troops are not as cunning or as smart as humans", but a Covenant battleship would have to direct all their power to the plasma cannons (including from the shields) to glass a planet (unlike an Imperial Star Destroyer). Slipspace is not as fast as hyperspace. The Milky Way is tiny compared to the huge Star Wars galaxy. Thus, they didn't have to invent anything faster than slipspace; because, they never had to. You said, "the UNSC could easily kick the butts of the Empire", actually it would be the other way around. The UNSC use PROJECTILE weapons that is what the Stormtrooper armor was made for. And, UNSC ships are actually quite primitive and tiny compared to a Victory-class Star Destroyer Mark II. UNSC ships have NO shielding. UNSC AI has no encryption codes that means an Imperial Slicer would be able to hack and control the whole UNSC ship. A Spartan is the Star Wars equivalent of a Storm Commando. The Storm Commandos are 10 times more equipped than a Spartan.

    In response to comment #7, They have no shielding at all.

    In response to comment #8, A UNSC ship's main cannon would be easily "deflected" by the Deflector Shields. Their ammo based weapons would be defended by the Particle Shields. UNSC did use shielding for Spatans, but it is very poor shielding.

    In response to comment #9, Amen.

    In response to comment #10, Actually the Ewoks were losing the battle until Chewbacca stole an AT-ST which really turned the tide of the battle. The Ewoks did score a few AT-ST kills,but the Ewoks were getting owned.

    In response to comment #11, Actually they are both outmatched by the Empire. How do you think they maintained MILLIONS of worlds.

    In rseponse to comment #14, Dude, one squad of Imperial Commandos and lead by one Imperial Knight wouldn't even leave the Dorsi or Pak a chance.

    In response to comment #15, True EMP's would be more than a match for the Covenant. Right about the hyperspace thing. Interdictor Cruisers would keep the Covenant from leaving. Yes, in groun battles, the Empire owns all (AT-ATs would wipe them all out). I do believe a picture of the Emperor would make the prophets wet in their hover chairs.

    In response to comment #16, Most Stormtroopers are cloned, and can control their own minds better than most humans. Thus, you wouldn't be able to "convert" them.

    In response to comment #17, HELLO! The Death Star was made for fighting against Capital-class Ships! It's the small ships (like X-wings) that can fly do some damage to the Death Star. The Death Star would come out of a space battle untouched. "... and glass Coruscant", the Covenant wouldn't be able to reach the Star Wars galaxy by slow slipspace before they all died of old age. Fuel Rod guns can be easily evaded by a Jedi or Sith. And a fuel Rod gun would barely penetrate Stormtrooper armor.

    In response to comment #19, Amen, but the Empire has bigger "freakin" ships (like the Supr Star Destroyer). True the Empire is superior in groun battles with Stormtroopers, Dark troopers, and vehicles. Same with star fighters, TIEs would fly loops around the Covenant fighters. The Empire has plasma-penetrative weapons. The Covenant doesn't. They do have plasme, just not concentrated enough to penetrate armor like a blaster from Star Wars.

    In response to comment #20, The Empire are not the Forerunners. Imperial fleets would beat the Covenant ones. You said, "... Master Chief could take on a buch of Stromtroopers and win", with what non-concentrated plasma weapons and projectile weapons. Dude, Stormtroopers would stand there while Spartan 117 shot at them. The Stormtroopers would aim and shoot a volley at Master Chief. Master Chief would be on the ground with scorching holes in in his armor and flesh, and the Stormtroopers would be standing still with barely any scratches on thier armor.

    In response to comment #21, True.

    In response to comment #22, It is Pillar of Autumn.

    In response to comment #24, The Covenant Capital Ship's pulse laser would be deflected by Star Wars shields, and the Covenant do not have EMP Shielding. Interdictor Cruisers are not useless; because, it has Huge Gravity-Well Projectors (the Covenant wouldn't be able to escape by using slipspace). The tractor beams would hold the Covenant down. AT-ATs tower above Scarabs. The AT-ATs armor is too strong fot a Scarab to penetrate it unless you shot it in the neck, but you would have to be in a ship to do that. The AT-At would blow a Scarab away before it even charged it's cannon. And the Empire would't stend out AT-STs until all the aircraft were destroyed. Even if the AT-STs were on the ground at the time, the phantoms an banshees would be blown by turrets or TIEs (banshees and phantoms are the slowest fighters the Empire would have ever encountered.

    In response to comment #25, You mean the Empire has Millions. And the "noob" Stormtroopers as seen on the Death Star, have only trained for a year before being deployed into a "Galactic-Civil War". Those noobs are the ones that can't shoot for beans,, but clones and "seasoned" Stormtroopers could shoot a pimple off an Ewok. Star Wars weapons do need to be realoaded, but it doesn't have specific number of shots; because, it is relaoded with plasma gas carbines that work until over-heated then you swap it with a new one.

    In response to comment #26, An Airspeeder ("snowspeeder") is 10 times better than a slow Banshee. The airspeeder isn't "cammon fodder". Airspeeders were used wisely against Imperial AT-ATs. Storm IV craft are used as "cannon fodder". Actually, a Flash Speeder ("police speeder") is shielded and has a better main cannon than a Specter. Speeder Bikes, Swoops, and Land Speeders are 5-10 times better than Ghosts. Dude, your whole "shield theory" is messed-up. A Planetary Shield is one of the most powerful shields in the whole universe (though it lasts for only a couple of weeks). The Covenant wouldn't be able to "... penetrate imperial shields". You are right about the Halo network. The Covenant does have access to the Halo network, but it would only destroy themselves (the Empire would escape through hyperspace). The Empire does have better weapons than the Covenant. The Covenant use primitive un-concentrated plasma weapons, when the Empire uses the exact opposite (which is better). One Thermal Detonator could (if planted in the right place) blow up a Covenant Capital Ship. 10 plasma grenades are nothing compared to ONE thermal detonator! Plasma swords are nothing compared to lightsabers or even vibro blades. And, it is Geonosis not "Geonosia". Iperial troops would never "... willingly sacrifice themselves for on trap", but mabey a cloned trooper would (not a non-cloned trooper, though).

    In response to comment #27, Actually your not quite right. The Stormtroopers on the Death Star (in Episode IV) were "noobs" who've never shot at a living enemy bofore! (as seen in Battle Front II, the 501st leave and the "new guys" come in).

    In response to comment #28, There is NO MAGIC!!!!!!!!!!!! It is the FORCE that controls everything in the Star Wars galaxy. And it is the "noob" Stormtrooper that couldn't hit Luke, Leia, Han, Chewbacca, C3-PO, and R2-D2. Not "magic", or even the force for that matter (though, the force was with Luke and Leia).

    In response to comment #29, Yes, it is the force. But, an Astromech Droid like R2-D2 is 30 times better than AI like Cortana. Plus, there are way better droids than an Astromech Droid.

    In response to comment #30, Nope, it is the FORCE!!!!!!!!!! A Protocol Droid is smarter than Cortana!

    In response to comment #31, You are right on one thing, Guri (see SW: Shadows of The Empire) would be 80 times better than Cortana. But, Guri isn't a Human Synth Droid it is a HRD (Human Replica Droid). Guri does have synth-flesh (cloned tissue). Another example of a HRD, is the one the New Republic used to replace Princess Leia ( as seen in Star Wars: Queen of the Empire). HRD droids are illegal; because the Empire didn't like the idea of other groups having assassin human-like Droids (like Guri and "Leia").

    In response to comment #32, Lobot is a human with a cyborg brain (Biotech Aj^6 cyborg head band). And, it is Cloud City on Bespin.

    In response to comment #35, Nice quote, but wrong theory. The Empire bought or stole everything that was high-tech. Stormtrooper armor doesn't have any "exploitable flaws". It does what it was made for against PROJECTILE weapons. If you have been wearing the armor all your life (like the clones) it doesn't restrict vision or mobility. Stormtrooper armor Mark III gives protection from blasters, but even Mark I gives protectio against Ewok spears. E-11 Blaster Rifles are some of the most accurate blasters (though the rapid fire isn't accurate). An E-11 could shoot strong bursts of shots at target miles away and hit it on the mark. The Death Star is vulnerable to attacks made by small ships (like X-wings), but other versions of the Death Star (like the Second) were going to change that [too bad it was destroyed before it was completed (although a galaxy would be ruled by IG-88)]. Did you forget that the Imperials have Particle Shields. They just didn't turn them on in time (like what happened to the Executor). There goes your "shield theory". "Lack of shields on imperial fighter craft..." true, but that is what the TIE Defender was made for (it has shielding). AT-ATs and AT-STs were never again to be deployed on Forrest Planets after the Battle of Endor (so they wouldn't trip on logs any more).

    In response to comment #36, You are correct. Most Stormtroopers are clones (not all from Jango), but there were many non-clone troopers (like the "noob" troopers) and mainly officers. You're on the right track on the weapon theory, but blasters from Star Wars are weapons with concentrated plasma, and the Covenant just use uncharged plasma that overheats quickly. The Stormtrooper armor would hold dozens or even hundreds of Covenant plasma shots.

    In response to comment #37, The Stormtrooper would come out completely unharmed. And, the flood wouldn't be able to penetrate Stormtrooper armor. The flood's pathetic forms wouldn't leave a scratch on the armor.

    In response to comment #38, True. Very true.

    In response to comment #39, Obi-Wan meant that Stormtroopers know exactly where and how to cripple something. The Sand People don't.

    In response to comment #40, I've read the books and comics from both sides. You said "In ground engagements with the Empire the Covenant would win". Hmmmmm... NO! The Elite would "pop out" shoot at the Stormtroopers and the Stormtroopers would turn around (while being unaffected by the blasts) and shoot 4 blasts at the enemy! 2 for the shields and 2 to kill it. Star Wars blasters use plasma, but it is in a thin bolt that penetrates armor (unlike the Covenant tech) that sends a concentrated blast. The armor would deflect Covenant plasma like a "glancing bolt" in Star Wars. In the end, the Covenant plasma wouldn't "leave a good sized scorch mark" on the Stormtrooper armor. In ship battles, the Empire would win as well, the Imperial's shields would deflect plasma torpedoes like a turbolaser bolt. The Empire has Proton Torpedoe Launchers(as seen in Star Wars: Revenge of The Sith), that would pass right through Covenant shields. And, the Empire has millions of bigger and better equipped ships than the Covenant does. The thousands of Star Destroyers would be more than a match for the Covenant fleet. And, TIEs are 30 times faster and equipped than Seraph (not "seriph") fighters.

    In response to comment #42, Imperials have shielding against almost every kind of attack. As you said after awhile they become vulnerable to them, but the Imperial would defeat the Covenant by then. The Star Destroyer's turbolaser is 30 times more powerful than the Covenant Capital Ship's weapons.

    This has been an Imperial-Galactic message. "Hail Emperor Roan Fel"-Grand Admiral Thrawn




    Well, that's it. I will be up for more discussions, just send your comments. Thank You.
    Last edited by Grand Admiral Thrawn; 2007-Mar-28 at 01:11 AM. Reason: Shedding some light on the subject.

  14. #44
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    In response to Grand Admiral Butt Nugget's essay its called an energy sword and when wielded by a senior elite can slaugter enemy forces plus u left brutes out of the picture a brute could kick a stormtrooper's *** the only stormtroopers that would be any good against covenant would be the 501st. normal stormtroopers are extremely vuneralble against paintball guns covenant elites are extremely strong even the lowest ranking elite could wipe out a group of stormtroopers they also have active camo which would let them sneak up behind a group of stomies and slaughter them the stormies from the movies are so weak that a single shot from han solo's blaster can kill them the stormies from the movies are so pathetic that my dog could kill them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!HALO IS THE FRIGGEN' BEST

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    I know the empire would lose because my brother is a star wars freak and even he says the empire would lose. I think that half the people on here are noobs I can tell most of them have never played Halo on Legendary

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    jackals on legendary can fire about 15 shots in two seconds the first shot
    would kill em and the rest domalish the body and thats right i'm his little
    brother so i should friggin know i've played through it on legendary with the wumpus

  17. #47
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    By the way num nuts who is roan fel??? it sounds like the color of a dogs fur
    yes the plasma would leave a good sized scorch mark stormies dont even use plasma they use lasers. and if a stormtroopers mark III armor is so good then what is Master Chief's mark VI armor like ????? HUH?? oh thats right its better isnt it and you it!!!!! plus he looks way cooler and his armor makes him strong enough to flip over a scorpian tank!!!!!!!!!!!

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    I came to this thread because of the name, WUMPUS, which brings back fond memories of an old, old computer game, "Hunt the Wumpus." But then I read your posts. Please read the board rules, especially rule three:

    http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=32864

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  19. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by WUMPUS View Post
    In response to Grand Admiral Butt Nugget's essay its called an energy sword and when wielded by a senior elite can slaugter enemy forces plus u left brutes out of the picture a brute could kick a stormtrooper's *** the only stormtroopers that would be any good against covenant would be the 501st. normal stormtroopers are extremely vuneralble against paintball guns covenant elites are extremely strong even the lowest ranking elite could wipe out a group of stormtroopers they also have active camo which would let them sneak up behind a group of stomies and slaughter them the stormies from the movies are so weak that a single shot from han solo's blaster can kill them the stormies from the movies are so pathetic that my dog could kill them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!HALO IS THE FRIGGEN' BEST
    From the following post you made, I can tell that you know little about the Halo and Star Wars universes alike; and you have no idea of what you post about.

    First of all, the weapon in the Halo universe is called a plasma sword. A plasma sword couldn't penetrate mark I armor. All stormtroopers including the 501st could take out the Covenant. Active camo is also very primitave; because it doesn't mask heat (the stormtroopers would pike up the signals through their HUD). Only the privileged Elites can wear active camo. Covenant weapons couldn't harm a Imperial Scout. And blasters are very high-tech when compared to Covenant weapons. Your dog would be raosted and be turned into a very tasty Imperial delicacy.

    And what in the world is wumpus!, It sounds like something I use to unclog my toilet!
    Last edited by Grand Admiral Thrawn; 2007-Mar-21 at 04:25 AM.

  20. 2007-Mar-19, 01:31 AM

  21. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by WUMPUS View Post
    I know the empire would lose because my brother is a star wars freak and even he says the empire would lose. I think that half the people on here are noobs I can tell most of them have never played Halo on Legendary
    Your brother knows not as much as I do. And, even if he does know quite a bit it does not change FACTS.

    And, I have played Halo and Halo 2 many times (both are great games).

    I've played them probably as many times as you have. And, I've read the books, have you?

  22. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by WUMPUS View Post
    jackals on legendary can fire about 15 shots in two seconds the first shot
    would kill em and the rest domalish the body and thats right i'm his little
    brother so i should friggin know i've played through it on legendary with the wumpus

    I've played on legendary as well, but a level setting (meaning the difficulty) doesn't count. So the Covenant wouldn't be set on Legendary (though either way their doomed).

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    Quote Originally Posted by WUMPUS View Post
    By the way num nuts who is roan fel??? it sounds like the color of a dogs fur
    yes the plasma would leave a good sized scorch mark stormies dont even use plasma they use lasers. and if a stormtroopers mark III armor is so good then what is Master Chief's mark VI armor like ????? HUH?? oh thats right its better isnt it and you it!!!!! plus he looks way cooler and his armor makes him strong enough to flip over a scorpian tank!!!!!!!!!!!
    Roan Fel is the Emperor of the Imperial Empire about 130 years after the Battle of Yavin.

    Plasma that is un-concentrated into a charged blast couln't penetrate mark I stormtrooper armor. Mark III Stormtrooper armor is the best (not even concentrated plasma from a blaster could penetrate it [read Star Wars: Tales from the Empire]).

    Master Chief's MJOLNIR armor Mark VI is the best armor the UNSC has at the moment. That means the Empire would have no trouble at all in penetrating it; because, the MJOLNIR Mark VI could be penetrated easily by a Star Wars blaster that uses charged plasma bolts unlike the uncharged shots used by the Covenant. You said "... his armor makes him strong..." actually it doesn't make him strong. Master Chief's abilities come from UNSC mutating.

    Your are right on only one thing. MJOLNIR armor Mark VI does look cooler.

  24. #53
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    First of all I thought that this was between the Covenant and the Empire.


    I would also concede the fact that the Covenant Navy would get trounced by the Empire.
    Itís just plain math: not sure of the numbers but the Empire has many many more ships than the Covenant. This is of course due to the fact that the Empire is after all a Galaxy-Spanning ďEmpireĒ, were as the Covenant is not...

    But of course I still donít think the covenant would be pushovers. Most of their ships are of equivalent size, the standard CCS-Class BattleCruiser is about 1700m in length, were as the ďStandardĒ (Iím guessing at it being the most common sight in fleets) Imperial-class Star Destroyer is 1600m in length. As for armaments, its been awhile since Iíve read the Halo novels, but Iím sure that a Plasma Torpedo could do some serious damage to a Star Destroyer. I say this because, the Titanium-A Armor that the UNSC uses is almost equal to the Durasteel that Star Destroyers use. Both metals are light and extremely strong, as well they both have a high tolerance for heat.
    This being said and seeing as how one plasma torpedo could burn through several decks and armor plating of UNSC ships, I would assume that they would do the same to Imperial ships.
    Also as a side note, it appears that covenant plasma weapons are even more effective vs shields.

    I also disagree with the assessment that the Torpedoes would ďDeflect plasma torpedoesĒ as they would detonate on impact, and wash over the ship shields doing heavy amounts of damage.

    Another point, Interdictor Cruisers Would be useless, because a Slipdrive can still operate within a gravity well, and ships have been able to enter Slipspace within a planets atmosphere (Being so close to a Natural Gravity well). When have you ever heard Hyperdrive being able to do that.

    Now I bring the argument to the ground, Lets start big then work our way down...

    Scarab vs AT-AT
    Now the Scarab and the AT-AT are roughly the same size, the AT-AT being about 22.5m in height and the Scarab being roughly 20m high, the armaments Iíd have to say are equal with a slight favor for the Scarabs plasma cannon (I donít think anything could survive it).

    Smaller vehicles: AT-ST vs Wrath mortar tank
    Here Iím going to go with who ever has the superior tactician on hand. This is because a Wrath is very deadly at long range, even if itís mortars are a little inaccurate. And the AT-ST is more of a short-medium range platform with highly accurate weapons. Although, if the Wrath survives a close AT-ST, then it could just ram it with speed boost and crumple the walker.

    Now for the juicy part... Infantry
    first thing is that the Plasma rifle, although different in theory than the particle beam that an E-11 fires is still just a deadly (In fact Iíd say the plasma rifle would be more deadly as even a glance could melt Plastoid). So as far as what Iíve seen a plasma rifle would be just as effective as a Stormtroopers E-11. You underestimate Plasma, concentrated or not, it makes no difference if it leaves a smoking hole were your chest was.
    As for Armor, Iíd also say theyíre equal, the Elites shields are better than you think and more than make up for a lack of full physical armor. That and Elites armors can have many options for different battlefield situations, such as environmental add-ons to protect against chemical and biological attacks, another add-on would be Active camouflage. It would also make sense that Active Camouflage masks heat as well, because if it didnít then every Spartan would also be equipped with thermal vision.
    Now to the actual soldier. I'd bet all of my life's savings that in hand to hand combat an Elite would win outright, the trooper wouldnít stand a snowballs chance in heil. This is because an Elite is just as strong as a Spartan, and a Spartan is roughly 5 to 10 times stronger than an average human. Now Iíve heard that Stormtroopers armor is powered, and so grants the user a little more strength, but Iíd bet no were on that magnitude of enhancement.

    Before you complain Thrawn, I have the book and would like to know on which page the specs for the mark 3 Stormtrooper armor are on. Right now I donít have the time to look, so the sources for the armor that Iíve used are from Wookieepedia, so I can accept any criticism on that part.

    PS: 1 Spartan could kill plenty of Stormtroopers, afterall they're about 5 to 10 times faster, stronger, and smarter, and well you get the point.

  25. #54
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    PS: 1 Spartan could kill plenty of Stormtroopers, afterall they're about 5 to 10 times faster, stronger, and smarter, and well you get the point.
    If the Master Chief fought the empire, the Master Chief would win. Eventually. Sure he might die dozens or even hundreds of times, but his ability to come back from the dead would allow him to eventually triumph.

    When I played Halo I was surprised the Covenant just didn't give up on trying to kill me after the first couple of dozen times I came back from the dead.

    And even if imperial weapons were much more powerful than Covenant weapons, the Chief would just somehow aquire more powerful shields that would make the difficulty of battleing the imperial forces challenging but fun. That's just the way these things seem to go.

  26. #55
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    Kyle Katarn

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Brak View Post
    If the Master Chief fought the empire, the Master Chief would win. Eventually. Sure he might die dozens or even hundreds of times, but his ability to come back from the dead would allow him to eventually triumph.
    Well, yes. Up until Kyle Katarn showed up. Then you'd have a stalemate.

  27. #56
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    How large are the Halo ships in comparison to Star Wars ships? The website Starship Deminsions doesn't yet have any Halo ships, but I seem to recall that at the end of halo you drive for about 3km from one end of the ship to the other, so I'm thinking they are pretty big. A star destroyer seems to be about 1km.

    Oh, and I think the little flame war between Wumpus and Thawn (in a three year old thread I might add) is quite hilarious.

  28. #57
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    I thought Red always wins it? - or was it Blue?

    Green Drazi!

  29. #58
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    Here are the Sizes and Armaments of each Covenant ship that has been seen

    Covenant Assault Carrier: 5346 meters
    Armament
    • Pulse Laser (Point Defense)
    • Energy Projectors (Main Weapon)


    Reverence-class Cruiser: 3000 meters
    Armament
    • 2+ Energy Projectors
    • 7+ Plasma Torpedo Launchers


    CCS-class Battlecruiser: 1782.2 meters
    Armament
    • Unknown But could have 0-1 Plasma Torpedo Launchers and Pulse Lasers


    Covenant Destroyer: 1500 meters
    Armament
    • Pulse Laser (Point Defense)
    • 2 Plasma Torpedo Launchers (Main Weapon)


    Covenant Carrier: 1455 meters
    Armament
    • Pulse Lasers
    • 2+ Plasma Torpedo Launchers


    Covenant Frigate: 1000 meters
    Armament
    • Anti-Plasma Torpedo counterguiding signal system
    • Pulse Laser turrets
    • 1 Lateral Plasma Torpedo launcher


    Covenant Stealth Corvette: Less than 485 meters
    Armament
    • No offencive Weapons
    • Stealth system
    • Fire-control jammers


    Seraph-class Starfighter: 24.8 meters
    Armament
    • Pulse Laser


    All souces are taken from: http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page
    and verified by each novel

  30. #59
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    Here are the Specs on Covenant Ships

    Covenant Assault Carrier: 5346m
    Armaments
    Pulse Laser Turrets
    Energy Projectors
    Unknown Number of Seraphs

    Reverence-Class Cruiser: 3000m
    Armaments
    Energy Projectors
    7 Plasma Torpedo Launchers

    CCS-Class BattleCruiser: 1782.2m
    Armaments
    Unknown but assumed to have
    Pulse lasers
    0-1 Plasma Torpedo Launchers

    CPV-Class Destroyer: 1500m
    Armaments
    Pulse lasers
    2 Plasma Torpedo Launchers

    Covenant Carrier: 1455m
    Armaments
    Pulse lasers
    2+ Plasma Torpedo Launchers
    36 Seraphs

    Covenant Frigate: 1000m
    Armaments
    Anti-Plasma Torpedo counter-guiding signal system
    Pulse lasers
    Plasma Torpedo Launcher

    Stealth Corvette: Less than 485m
    Armaments

    No Offensive Weapons
    Stealth system
    Fire-control jammers

    Seraph Starfighter
    Armaments
    Pulse lasers

    As you can see Most of the ships are bigger than the average Star Destroyer

  31. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kahardrin View Post
    First of all I thought that this was between the Covenant and the Empire.


    I would also concede the fact that the Covenant Navy would get trounced by the Empire.
    Itís just plain math: not sure of the numbers but the Empire has many many more ships than the Covenant. This is of course due to the fact that the Empire is after all a Galaxy-Spanning ďEmpireĒ, were as the Covenant is not...

    But of course I still donít think the covenant would be pushovers. Most of their ships are of equivalent size, the standard CCS-Class BattleCruiser is about 1700m in length, were as the ďStandardĒ (Iím guessing at it being the most common sight in fleets) Imperial-class Star Destroyer is 1600m in length. As for armaments, its been awhile since Iíve read the Halo novels, but Iím sure that a Plasma Torpedo could do some serious damage to a Star Destroyer. I say this because, the Titanium-A Armor that the UNSC uses is almost equal to the Durasteel that Star Destroyers use. Both metals are light and extremely strong, as well they both have a high tolerance for heat.
    This being said and seeing as how one plasma torpedo could burn through several decks and armor plating of UNSC ships, I would assume that they would do the same to Imperial ships.
    Also as a side note, it appears that covenant plasma weapons are even more effective vs shields.

    I also disagree with the assessment that the Torpedoes would ďDeflect plasma torpedoesĒ as they would detonate on impact, and wash over the ship shields doing heavy amounts of damage.

    Another point, Interdictor Cruisers Would be useless, because a Slipdrive can still operate within a gravity well, and ships have been able to enter Slipspace within a planets atmosphere (Being so close to a Natural Gravity well). When have you ever heard Hyperdrive being able to do that.

    Now I bring the argument to the ground, Lets start big then work our way down...

    Scarab vs AT-AT
    Now the Scarab and the AT-AT are roughly the same size, the AT-AT being about 22.5m in height and the Scarab being roughly 20m high, the armaments Iíd have to say are equal with a slight favor for the Scarabs plasma cannon (I donít think anything could survive it).

    Smaller vehicles: AT-ST vs Wrath mortar tank
    Here Iím going to go with who ever has the superior tactician on hand. This is because a Wrath is very deadly at long range, even if itís mortars are a little inaccurate. And the AT-ST is more of a short-medium range platform with highly accurate weapons. Although, if the Wrath survives a close AT-ST, then it could just ram it with speed boost and crumple the walker.

    Now for the juicy part... Infantry
    first thing is that the Plasma rifle, although different in theory than the particle beam that an E-11 fires is still just a deadly (In fact Iíd say the plasma rifle would be more deadly as even a glance could melt Plastoid). So as far as what Iíve seen a plasma rifle would be just as effective as a Stormtroopers E-11. You underestimate Plasma, concentrated or not, it makes no difference if it leaves a smoking hole were your chest was.
    As for Armor, Iíd also say theyíre equal, the Elites shields are better than you think and more than make up for a lack of full physical armor. That and Elites armors can have many options for different battlefield situations, such as environmental add-ons to protect against chemical and biological attacks, another add-on would be Active camouflage. It would also make sense that Active Camouflage masks heat as well, because if it didnít then every Spartan would also be equipped with thermal vision.
    Now to the actual soldier. I'd bet all of my life's savings that in hand to hand combat an Elite would win outright, the trooper wouldnít stand a snowballs chance in heil. This is because an Elite is just as strong as a Spartan, and a Spartan is roughly 5 to 10 times stronger than an average human. Now Iíve heard that Stormtroopers armor is powered, and so grants the user a little more strength, but Iíd bet no were on that magnitude of enhancement.

    Before you complain Thrawn, I have the book and would like to know on which page the specs for the mark 3 Stormtrooper armor are on. Right now I donít have the time to look, so the sources for the armor that Iíve used are from Wookieepedia, so I can accept any criticism on that part.

    PS: 1 Spartan could kill plenty of Stormtroopers, afterall they're about 5 to 10 times faster, stronger, and smarter, and well you get the point.
    You have some wrong facts there.

    This is between the Covenant and the Empire, but it kind of evolved into a Halo vs. Star Wars galaxy.

    You are right that the Covenant would get owned by the Empire.

    A Covenant Battlecruiser is 1782m.

    An Imperial-class Star Destroyer is 1605m.

    The Covenant wins in size, but it losses for lack of higher technology.
    The Star Destroyer has Particle Shields (look it up) that would protect it from plasma torpedoes. And, Star Destroyers carry Turbolaser turrets that are far better than pulse lasers (look it up). Proton torpedoes release a devastatng wave of protons that detonate a warhead that causes a huge explosion (way better than a plasma torpedo) (see Star Wars The New And Essential Guide To Vehicles & Vessels [pages XII]). The Imperial-class Star Destroyer would outmatch any Covenant Ship. You need to read up on what a Particle Shield is capable of (it DEFLECTS PROJECTILES[ a.k.a. plasma torpedoes would be "deflected"]).

    Do you need to refreshed on what an Interdictor Cruiser is capable of?
    They have Huge GRAVITY-WELL PROJECTORS!!!!! And TRACTOR BEAM PROJECTORS!!!!! Do you know what a tracto beam is?!!!!

    Well... The TRACTOR BEAM would hold any ship it sets it's projector on. Thus, your Covenant Ships would be pulled ( with a gravitational pull) into the hands of the Empire! You wouldn't be able to use slipspace; because, the tractor beam would be LOCKED on its position. Even if slipspace could could stop the Gravity-wells, it would be stopped by the Tracor Beam (did you think of that... NO).

    You have the sizes all wrong for the AT-AT and Scarab. The AT-AT is about 15.5 meters taller than a scarab! And the Scarab's plasma cannon isn't hot enough to penetrate the AT-ATs armor (Doonium).

    And you seem to forget, that tha AT-ST has missile launchers that would blow wraiths away!

    In hand-to-hand combat a clone or "seasoned" would kill the Elite, but not a "noob" trooper. And Mark III stops plasma. You have no idea of what you post about. So I suggest that you look up the difference between concentrated and un-concentrated plasma!

    And Mark III armor is the same armor used in Tinian On Trial pages 33-34 from Star Wars Tales from the Empire.

    1 Spartan is equal to 1 Clone Commando! And the Empire has hundreds of commandos!

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